Private Members’ Clubs, Tackling Homelessness and Social Impact
Episode 63
Rosie Ferguson is CEO of The House of St Barnabas, a private members’ club which works to end the cycle of homelessness. The House of St Barnabas offers a three-month employment preparation programme where people can learn hospitality, catering and office skills to help them get their lives back on track.
The conversation this week explores the future and patriarchal history of private members’ clubs, and how The House of St Barnabas is an innovative club rooted in social change, inclusivity and community. Rosie discusses how the pandemic has affected The House and the ways they have adapted to continue providing support for those that need it most.
Rosie also tells us the impact that Covid has had on the third sector and how the pandemic has accelerated digital and technological change within charitable organisations. And finally, Rosie leaves us with her advice on working in social impact and says, “If you think something needs to be changed, you're probably the best person to change it.”
This conversation was recorded on 2nd December 2020. We hope you enjoy listening.
This episode is brought to you by Ohne. Find out more - https://www.thewotpod.com/ohne
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Episode Chapters
03:30 Chapter 1 - The House of St Barnabas
08:40 Chapter 2 - The future and history of private members’ clubs
11:15 Chapter 3 - The Employment Academy
14:17 Chapter 4 - 2020’s Impact on homelessness and The House of St Barnabas
21:54 Chapter 5 - The pandemic’s impact on the third sector
25:18 Chapter 6 - Optimising social impact
28:12 Chapter 7 - Advice for working in social impact
Connect with Rosie Ferguson and The House of St Barnabas
Connect with Frankie Cotton
Team
Guests - Rosie Ferguson
Host - Frankie Cotton
Production Support - Georgia Buchanan
Sound Editor - Beth Davison
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EPISODE 63 TRANSCRIPT
Frankie Cotton Rosie, welcome to Women on Top.
Rosie Ferguson Thank you. Hello!
Frankie Cotton How are you? So I know that you've just reopened your doors today. How are you feeling?
Rosie Ferguson Very excited. We just had we opened at 10 o'clock this morning, so we've just had a number of the first few members trickling back in. And we've got some private hire filming going on as well. And the Christmas decorations are up. The coffee machine is on, and the mulled wine is stewing. So I'm very excited to be back open.
Frankie Cotton Gosh, I'm just imagining that. And I just want to be there. I wonder if you could start by telling us a little bit about the House of St Barnabas and the work that you do show.
Rosie Ferguson So House of St Barnabas is a private members'' club in Soho, where on the corner of Greek Street and Soho Square and we're a little bit different in that we're a social purpose, private members club so we're working to break the cycle of homelessness. So we do that by supporting people who previously experienced homelessness to get back into a secure home, a secure job and the secure kind of community and network. As part of that, they train in the clubs that they do work experience and personal development programmes in the members' club, whilst at the same time our members, actors, mentors and employers for our participants and graduates, and we have a kind of community of people who convene around topics relating to homelessness and good work, as well as being a really good fun club. So we're in a beautiful, grade one listed building, in normal times we have kind of club nights and events and all sorts of cultural things going on. Currently, we're mainly a workspace and a place where people can come in and eat and drink, of course, together substantially at the moment as we're in Tier 2. But yes, so we are, we are a fun place focussed to deliver impact.
Frankie Cotton And the way that you operate feels really innovative. So with the social focussed commercial entity and also the charity and I wonder Rosie if you could sort of shed a bit of light on how that works structurally and how it's designed to work in this sort of innovative way.
Rosie Ferguson Sure, so we are the charity is the kind of main body of the main organisation and then we have a trading subsidiary within the charity. So the charity is the kind of leader and makes the decisions and also the buildings. We also, as well as our mission around social impact, we have two grade one listed buildings, the house and the chapel which is attached to the house. So the charity is responsible for making sure that we we are delivering our impact. And then within that, the social business, the social business has a board and is focussed on the kind of commercials around membership, private hire, hospitality, but that, all of the profits that the business make are then automatically gift-aided wholly up to the charity. So the charity is kind of the boss, if you like, and the commercial businesses kind of works for the charity.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, that makes sense. And Rosie I wonder if you could tell us a bit more about your members and who you attract. So you mentioned there that sort of this mentorship and kind of really being a part of the ethos. And I wonder if you could tell us how and maybe it's obvious, but how you sort of attract maybe slightly different people, traditional private members' club or what's different about what you offer?
Rosie Ferguson Yeah, interesting. So where a lot of private members, clubs historically have focussed on a sector. So, for example, they might be really focussed on people from media or focus from people in the city or a kind of really what we have as people from a whole range of professions. So we have people from media finance, the arts, the social sector, housing associations, public sector but what all have in common is the commitment to social change and a commitment to wanting to eat and drink and have cocktails and delicious food in a place that is making a difference. So that's what really unites our community. We're also committed to being London's most diverse members' club. So we're aiming to make sure that we're inclusive, that there's a kind of slight tension around that kind of inclusive exclusivity. But actually, we're really keen to make sure that we're aware of some, historically members' clubs kind of trade on the idea that you only feel welcome if you're part of the club. I think here for us, it's absolutely essential that anyone who walks through the door is absolutely welcome, that nobody feels like they're not good enough or wealthy enough or or they don't look right to be in here and that it's a place where, yes, you do have to you have to pay to be a member, you have to pay to come in. But but we are a place that's here for anyone that kind of shares our values and is committed to what we're doing. And I think particularly our participants and graduates walk through the front doors as people who have experienced homelessness and they are just as welcome and a part of what we do and included in the community as people who are paying the membership fee and spending money on a nice lunch. So that's a really important part of our ethos.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, and I, and I find it so interesting because only recently I've been having conversations with peers and with friends about private members' clubs. It feels like in the last few years there's been a number of them, particularly sort of female focus that have popped up in London. And well, I mean, The Wing collapsed recently. And of course, we still have the Allbright and others, but we've been sort of debating this around private members' club, sort of having their history rooted in elitism and the patriarchy. And, you know, some of the things you talked about there. And we were both, well one friend in particular, we were both sort of thinking, are we a bit over private members' clubs? But when I was reading about what you guys do at the House of St Barnabas, I just thought, no, this is a whole new way of delivering something amazing for everyone. And I wonder, have you seen more of the membership intake or more interest over the past few years or have you been growing or what's happening?
Rosie Ferguson Yeah, we were certainly growing in the kind of pre-Covid trajectory. I think they're very much is a space and actually with, and actually this hopefully will be enhanced by Covid you know, people want a space where they can meet up with colleagues and sit and work for a day or half a day where they can bring their friends and know they're going to get a table and someone will know their name when they arrive. And I think that there is something, particularly in London, about the sense of community in a place where you belong that doesn't need to, and, yes, people pay a membership fee to have access to that but I think that is different. It feels different to meeting your colleagues for coffee in a kind of Pret on the corner or to go into a restaurant where you are anonymous. And there is something about, I think, community and space and the flexibility that the place offers that is, that there is a need for and I think for us building communities is really important. There's a lot more we want to do around there in terms of how do you really make people feel that connection to the House and a connection to the people and the people who we who we support and serve.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, and that's interesting because sort of arguably coworking spaces sort of aimed to fill that gap. But I believe that, or certainly, my experience is that the community aspect is often missing. You know you don't have that same experience. People don't really know your name and you don't have those conversations and those kinds of things, it's just a little bit, there's something amazing about that sort of atmosphere right in the community, which is what you're talking about. And Rosie, can you tell us a bit more about the Employment Academy and how that side of things works?
Rosie Ferguson Yes. So we work with people who have experienced homelessness or being at risk of homelessness at the point that they're ready to start thinking about going back to work or progressing into some kind of stability. So we will work with other agencies who engage with people to the point that they're street sleeping or that they're kind of right in the middle of their of their homelessness challenges. And they will then take referrals from organisations like Centerpoint and New Horizon, Youth Organisation, a number of prisoners abroad. So a number of other agencies who support the people to get to the point where they are currently not abusing substances, where they've got somewhere safe to sleep and where they're ready to start thinking about moving their life forward. So then they come to us. They initially do an intensive personal development and employment preparation programme where they really, that's all based in the House and we work with them on all the how to get a job and CVs and employment, and they do work experience both in the club and in our offices based on their passion. So we have a whole range, whether they're working in our art collection or whether they're working on membership or in finance or in the kitchen. So we offer work experience. But I think what makes us really distinctive is that alongside that focus on work, we have a real focus on their personal development. So they're very much part of our community here. The team with a kind of meditation sessions as part of the programme. Normally they'd go to the theatre, they do an art tour of the building. So it's really about helping people rebuild their sense of dignity and community and that they're that they're a whole person. And there's a lot going on for them. They're not just a unit who's been homeless and now needs a job they're not just about, so that really works well. And the group's really bond. And then following that, we work with people, we provide people with progression support for a year after the programme so that really helps them focus on, so then we help them move into more secure accommodation. We help them get better work, so aiming to get people not just into fragile entry level jobs, but into living wage jobs that are kind of fulfilling for them and also they have a, they have a mentor who really helps them kind of give them that additional support and community. So it's really focussed on those three things, a secure home, a good job, and a community of people that will be there to support them for the long term. And that is how we think you genuinely break the cycle of homelessness rather than hold people in a position where they're kind of fragile and waiting for the next thing to go wrong.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, that's amazing. And I mean, maybe it sort of goes without saying, but I wonder how it's been affected this year, because I imagine that it's been tough for you both on the club side and also on the Employment Academy side. And how has how have you managed this year? I mean, how have you sort of pivoted or what have you had to do?
Rosie Ferguson So firstly, on the employment economy side, when lockdown happened in March, we had, we normally support people for a year and then aim to get them in a secure place by that point, whereas we decided we had 100 hundred people who'd graduated in the last couple of years who were in contact with us, and we absolutely focussed on upping the support to them. So we increased the number of mentor engagements, we sent out food packages, we did kind of, we provided counselling for some people who were really struggling. A lot of those people, so 50 percent of that cohort that were working in March. 50 percent of them are now being made redundant or are no longer in work. I mean, it was really sad to see people because a lot of people have been focussing on the hospitality sector, the impact on them. Additionally, obviously, everything went online and actually that community of people really rely on things like libraries to be able to have Internet access and digital. So suddenly people were totally cut off from not just accessing universal credit, which is all done online, not NHS appointments were all online, but they were also cut off from their own friends and family because all of that contact, both social and public and professional life, all moved online. So we did work supporting people trying to get access to laptops, to access to digital. And yeah, so that was a really intensive period and navigating those fluctuations in income when actually they didn't have the digital capacity to do their universal credit claims and so it was is a really challenging time. And, but also carrying on the theme around peoples, you know, people being whole, people, actually, some people, well, there was one individual actually who really want to play the guitar. And we managed to find somebody in our membership who donated a guitar that person learnt the guitar. So it's kind of yes, we were helping people to kind of make sure they could eat but actually for all of us that mental health element. We also had a couple of bikes donated by members so that graduates could use bikes so they could travel to work. They could. So. So, yeah, it was it was quite active and intensive. We then once we opened again, ran programme. We know that not having any face to face contact is really detrimental to the community we support, particularly people who are living in hostels or in kind of insecure accommodation where they're just shot in their room. So we we decided to run programme. We were quite nervous about doing it face to face, but we really put in place so much covid secure practice so obviously, being in the hospitality sector, we have to be any way into the masks and social distancing and hand sanitiser stations in every room. So we did manage to run a programme and run all of the work experience. And actually I think it was one of the best programmes we've ever run because the people were so desperate to be. We had 100 percent completion, even though it was in the middle of a pandemic, because I think people's people's needs to engage and connect and feel like they were moving forward in their lives was was really, really important. So we have managed to run programme and we're now supporting all those people to think about what next in terms of the business. Sadly, we have been closed, we have we're down 40 percent on our income this year, so we've had we have had a huge financial impact. We've obviously managed to save some funds, obviously, by making use of the furlough scheme. Sadly we have had to reduce the size of our team through redundancies. But actually we've increased the scale of work we're doing to support those who we serve because the level of need is so much higher. So it's tough. And we've had we've certainly had some very challenging moments. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that by by the summer of next year, we might be getting somewhere back to normal.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, yeah. And I and I wonder I mean, it sounds like you've done some amazing work in the short term and and sort of mid-term to cope with the pandemic and the effects of that. But I wonder, do you have a view as to what the long term looks like both for the academy and the club? And will you be making changes have there been any because sometimes there have been some pleasant surprises along the way, few and far between, but there can be a couple.
Rosie Ferguson I think, in terms of the club, one of the things that's changed is I think how people will work going forward. And I think now people, I think most people won't be going into, people who work in offices, won't be going into offices five days a week. So a lot of organisations I know who are kind of getting rid of their offices entirely, from what I heard someone say the other day that actually offices will be more like member clubs going forward because people will do their, their kind of desk space work at home and people will come in to town or into the office in order to engage with people, to connect with colleagues. They won't necessarily need to come into an office to do their desk work. So I think that actually creates a real opportunity for members' clubs because that is absolutely what our space is for. So hopefully, hopefully there will be a shift towards that. And we're looking at the kind of packages we can offer. I think the real focus on the Black Lives Matter movement through this year has been really exciting. And it's made us I mean, I think we already had a strong agenda around inclusivity, what it's enabled is some really open conversations about how it feels to be a black person in a members' club and that actually you know I've heard some pretty yeah distressing and unacceptable stories of people feeling indifferent membership and environments that people look at them as though they shouldn't be there. And I think we've really determined to make sure that The House of St Barnabas is a place where we're actually we're a really thriving, diverse community that reflects London and where everybody feels like it's there, it's their space. And we've currently got an exhibition on the artist Gaikai has done exploring the relationship between the the fabric of the building here and the historic links to slavery and to plantations in Jamaica. So that's really anyone's welcome to come and have a look around that if they'd like to.
Frankie Cotton Gosh, that sounds interesting.
Rosie Ferguson Yeah. Our director of engagement here actually originated from, her family came from the area of Jamaica, which was owned as plantations by the person that built from some of the kind of main features of the house here. So some really interesting connections to have been exploring. In terms of the employment academy, I think we've in the programme this year, we did an increased focus on kind of health and safety work and increased focus on digital, because I think whatever sector people are going into really making sure that they have that digital skill and connectivity is going to be even more important than ever before. And then thinking about the industries that we're supporting people into, historically, we've supported a lot of people in hospitality and we won't stop having that connection with hospitality but really thinking actually debt advice, for example, has been one area where we've been able to support people into, you know, what are the and actually a lot many of our many of the people who we work with are actually well equipped to go into that kind of role, having had personal experience themselves, so really thinking about what are the jobs that will provide security to people on the other side of this. And also, how do we make sure that the hospitality sector is kind of built back better in terms of the types of contracts and pay and and things that we've seen as kind of making people catastrophically vulnerable I would say.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, definitely. Now, Rosie, as if you're not busy enough, you're also chair of the Association of Chief Executives of Voluntary Organisations. And from your perspective in that role, I wonder sort of a bit more generally and a bit more broadly, how is the sector doing right now in light of this turbulent year?
Rosie Ferguson Yeah, I mean, I would say the first thing to say is that the pandemic has hit those who are already at the bottom or already those people who charities are mainly there to support, whether that's young people, single parents, people living with cancer, people who are carers, people who are many of the communities that charities exist to support people with dementia, like they're the people who have been worst hit by the pandemic in terms of whether that's to do with all of the complex issues around what lockdown's created, where the kind of prioritisation of capability in the NHS. So I would say the sector is in the most part, dealing with much greater need, with much less resource, because at the same time giving to charities has reduced, a lot of the fundraising opportunities like the marathon and things that and also charities like us that rely on social enterprise income, many of whom have shifted over the last decade or two, where social enterprise income has been a focus of where we want to get and then obviously that's being completely decimated for many people, so it is a tough time, I think, for leadership, for chief executive staff and charities, often a lot of people be furloughed, a lot of people are made redundant. So you've essentially got less resource and more need. So it is a challenging time. I think some of the some of the positives, if I, you know, I am an optimist. I'm always determined to see some silver linings in this. I think the pandemic has seen a speed of innovation in some charity where, where, where charities have been forced to very quickly move online and kind of digitise some of their services in a way that would have been a kind of five year digital transformation programme that happened in five weeks or five days in some cases. So I think certainly there's been a huge shift, which I think will put the sector in good stead for the future. And I think also some of the some of the kind of risk taking and the the way that charities are really, here I would say at The House of St Barnabas when when you're really pressured around the finances, a real conversation, a board level about what matters and is this worth fighting for? And do do we believe that riding through this in order to make sure we can deliver our impact on the other side is critical? And actually, I think certainly our board trustees are really focussed on that and making sure that we absolutely deliver a greater impact on the other side of this, I think, so I think it has focussed a lot of charities, but there's no doubt that it's been challenging and that there are still, but I think next year we're going to really see a lot of charities who've been working on causes where they've made real progress over the last 10 years. They're going to have seen some of that progress move backwards in terms of poverty and many of the issues the charities campaigned on.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, I mean, it's a tough one, isn't it? And I and I appreciate your your optimism about sort of some of the innovations, but it is just a bit of a shit situation, you know. Like you say is there's more demand and less resources in this. Yeah. There's no quick or easy solution to either of those things. But I do wonder Rosie, sort of looking forward for perhaps people listening to this podcast who either work in the voluntary sector, perhaps thinking about starting a charity or looking at social impact, social enterprise – what do you think is sort of the key to and maybe this is the million dollar question, but to kind of creating and leading organisations that optimise impact? Because what you do in The House of St Barnabas feels, as I said before, really innovative. And and you have that sort of commercial and the charity working together. And I wonder, is that sort of something that you see is as happening more and more in the future? Or what's your view on that?
Rosie Ferguson I think for me, it depends really what difference people are trying to make. And there will be the kind of form and structure and exactly what you do will differ depending on the change that you're trying to see. So for some, I previously worked for Gingerbread, the single parent charity, and it was clear there that that growth was about changing policy because actually the the structural inequality facing single parents around the kind of public financing and a lot of the kind of public services with so, that actually delivering services to one thousand, two thousand three thousand people a year was not going to cut it. And so I think that was an organisation where what we needed to do was to really focus on the structural change. There are other charities that are a local youth project, for example, where actually it's really about really engaging that community and bringing in as much kind of social capital locally and volunteers as necessary. And that is where probably trusts and foundations is the right is the right method. And then there's organisations like ours where actually building a community of employers and mentors and and, um, the kind of commercial offer is a part of the way we can deliver our impact. So I think it really, I don't think there's kind of one thing, one way that people should approach delivering social impacts it's kind of what are you trying to change and then what's the best form in order to deliver that? I think being really clear about the differences people are trying to make and the most effective way to do that, and continually open to kind of challenging that and asking those questions again and again as the charity evolves as well.
Frankie Cotton Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I can see that. And I wonder Rosie a bit more of a sort of personal question, but reflecting on your career and what's led you to this point. Again, for somebody listening who perhaps works in the sector, or is thinking about it. What advice would you give to someone?
Rosie Ferguson So my, one of my early bosses in the sector had a poster on his wall that said work hard and be nice to people and that that has always stuck with me as a you know, I think we're here in the sector to make impact, and I think the people who I know who, the people who I like working with, the people who I know who kind of progress in the sector is actually kind of take responsibility for what you can change, build strong and trusting relationships with people inside and outside of your organisation and be the best you can be, you know. And that's not about working yourself to death, that's also, of course, about looking after yourself and but actually commit to what you're doing and take responsibility and don't wait for other people to kind of hand opportunities to you or to take the other thing is around asking, you know, ask forgiveness, not permission. We, don't sit around waiting for someone else to ask you for help, like, actually see what the opportunities are, see what needs to change and take responsibility for fixing it. And that's where that's certainly throughout my career in terms of probably too much sometimes, but probably get better at saying, actually, I'm not going to do that and delegates it out to somebody else. But I certainly think, yes, see what needs to be. If you think something needs to be changed, you're the probably the best person to change it.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, yeah. I love that. That's very powerful. And I wonder Rosie what sort of drives you and keeps you going because I imagine that, you know, some days can be can be tough. And, you know, you see all sorts of of different situations and people really tough situations as well. And I wonder what keeps you motivated and what drives you through those?
Rosie Ferguson I think seeing the, having programme here, I had a young man from Nigeria on work experience with me as part of our programme that we had just before this lockdown and having him working alongside me and his absolute brilliance and ambition and clarity of what it was that he wanted to do, despite the challenges that he's faced, was really inspiring. And I think it's certainly here at the House that keeps us all motivated through this challenging year, having participants' around and working alongside us who are so keen to learn and to progress and to kind of move their lives forward. Yeah, I think that impact and also just being with people, I'm just saying it's just on the last day of the second lockdown and I live on my own, so I am just delighted, I bounded out of bed this morning, bounded into the gym. I've already had like 59 conversations with different people. So just the opportunity to be, and being here at the House, the energy and the atmosphere that we can have, even when we're not able to be all-singing, all-dancing, literally, as we normally are. Yeah. So I would say the kind of personal connections with people who I have come across day today.
Frankie Cotton Gosh. Well, Rosie, I really want to come over and have a coffee and a mulled wine.
Rosie Ferguson Please do, you're very welcome.
Frankie Cotton And all of it. And I'm in no doubt that anyone listening to this podcast is also feeling the same. Sounds like a wonderful place to be, especially in the lead up to Christmas at the moment. Well, Rosie, thank you so much for everything you've shared with us and for telling us all about the work that you do. I just want to give you the opportunity before we close. Is there anything that we've not mentioned or something that you'd like to leave us on?
Rosie Ferguson Just, I suppose, a plug that we are open for membership. And if people would like to come and be part of The House of St Barnabas community, we also are a private higher venue. So once people are allowed to start organising meetings and parties, let's hope one day we might be allowed to have parties. Please think of us. And yeah, you can come and be in a fabulous space while supporting a brilliant cause.
Frankie Cotton Brilliant. Thank you so much.
Rosie Ferguson Thanks a lot.
Frankie Cotton Rosie, welcome to Women on Top.
Rosie Ferguson Thank you. Hello!
Frankie Cotton How are you? So I know that you've just reopened your doors today. How are you feeling?
Rosie Ferguson Very excited. We just had we opened at 10 o'clock this morning, so we've just had a number of the first few members trickling back in. And we've got some private hire filming going on as well. And the Christmas decorations are up. The coffee machine is on, and the mulled wine is stewing. So I'm very excited to be back open.
Frankie Cotton Gosh, I'm just imagining that. And I just want to be there. I wonder if you could start by telling us a little bit about the House of St Barnabas and the work that you do show.
Rosie Ferguson So House of St Barnabas is a private members'' club in Soho, where on the corner of Greek Street and Soho Square and we're a little bit different in that we're a social purpose, private members club so we're working to break the cycle of homelessness. So we do that by supporting people who previously experienced homelessness to get back into a secure home, a secure job and the secure kind of community and network. As part of that, they train in the clubs that they do work experience and personal development programmes in the members' club, whilst at the same time our members, actors, mentors and employers for our participants and graduates, and we have a kind of community of people who convene around topics relating to homelessness and good work, as well as being a really good fun club. So we're in a beautiful, grade one listed building, in normal times we have kind of club nights and events and all sorts of cultural things going on. Currently, we're mainly a workspace and a place where people can come in and eat and drink, of course, together substantially at the moment as we're in Tier 2. But yes, so we are, we are a fun place focussed to deliver impact.
Frankie Cotton And the way that you operate feels really innovative. So with the social focussed commercial entity and also the charity and I wonder Rosie if you could sort of shed a bit of light on how that works structurally and how it's designed to work in this sort of innovative way.
Rosie Ferguson Sure, so we are the charity is the kind of main body of the main organisation and then we have a trading subsidiary within the charity. So the charity is the kind of leader and makes the decisions and also the buildings. We also, as well as our mission around social impact, we have two grade one listed buildings, the house and the chapel which is attached to the house. So the charity is responsible for making sure that we we are delivering our impact. And then within that, the social business, the social business has a board and is focussed on the kind of commercials around membership, private hire, hospitality, but that, all of the profits that the business make are then automatically gift-aided wholly up to the charity. So the charity is kind of the boss, if you like, and the commercial businesses kind of works for the charity.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, that makes sense. And Rosie I wonder if you could tell us a bit more about your members and who you attract. So you mentioned there that sort of this mentorship and kind of really being a part of the ethos. And I wonder if you could tell us how and maybe it's obvious, but how you sort of attract maybe slightly different people, traditional private members' club or what's different about what you offer?
Rosie Ferguson Yeah, interesting. So where a lot of private members, clubs historically have focussed on a sector. So, for example, they might be really focussed on people from media or focus from people in the city or a kind of really what we have as people from a whole range of professions. So we have people from media finance, the arts, the social sector, housing associations, public sector but what all have in common is the commitment to social change and a commitment to wanting to eat and drink and have cocktails and delicious food in a place that is making a difference. So that's what really unites our community. We're also committed to being London's most diverse members' club. So we're aiming to make sure that we're inclusive, that there's a kind of slight tension around that kind of inclusive exclusivity. But actually, we're really keen to make sure that we're aware of some, historically members' clubs kind of trade on the idea that you only feel welcome if you're part of the club. I think here for us, it's absolutely essential that anyone who walks through the door is absolutely welcome, that nobody feels like they're not good enough or wealthy enough or or they don't look right to be in here and that it's a place where, yes, you do have to you have to pay to be a member, you have to pay to come in. But but we are a place that's here for anyone that kind of shares our values and is committed to what we're doing. And I think particularly our participants and graduates walk through the front doors as people who have experienced homelessness and they are just as welcome and a part of what we do and included in the community as people who are paying the membership fee and spending money on a nice lunch. So that's a really important part of our ethos.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, and I, and I find it so interesting because only recently I've been having conversations with peers and with friends about private members' clubs. It feels like in the last few years there's been a number of them, particularly sort of female focus that have popped up in London. And well, I mean, The Wing collapsed recently. And of course, we still have the Allbright and others, but we've been sort of debating this around private members' club, sort of having their history rooted in elitism and the patriarchy. And, you know, some of the things you talked about there. And we were both, well one friend in particular, we were both sort of thinking, are we a bit over private members' clubs? But when I was reading about what you guys do at the House of St Barnabas, I just thought, no, this is a whole new way of delivering something amazing for everyone. And I wonder, have you seen more of the membership intake or more interest over the past few years or have you been growing or what's happening?
Rosie Ferguson Yeah, we were certainly growing in the kind of pre-Covid trajectory. I think they're very much is a space and actually with, and actually this hopefully will be enhanced by Covid you know, people want a space where they can meet up with colleagues and sit and work for a day or half a day where they can bring their friends and know they're going to get a table and someone will know their name when they arrive. And I think that there is something, particularly in London, about the sense of community in a place where you belong that doesn't need to, and, yes, people pay a membership fee to have access to that but I think that is different. It feels different to meeting your colleagues for coffee in a kind of Pret on the corner or to go into a restaurant where you are anonymous. And there is something about, I think, community and space and the flexibility that the place offers that is, that there is a need for and I think for us building communities is really important. There's a lot more we want to do around there in terms of how do you really make people feel that connection to the House and a connection to the people and the people who we who we support and serve.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, and that's interesting because sort of arguably coworking spaces sort of aimed to fill that gap. But I believe that, or certainly, my experience is that the community aspect is often missing. You know you don't have that same experience. People don't really know your name and you don't have those conversations and those kinds of things, it's just a little bit, there's something amazing about that sort of atmosphere right in the community, which is what you're talking about. And Rosie, can you tell us a bit more about the Employment Academy and how that side of things works?
Rosie Ferguson Yes. So we work with people who have experienced homelessness or being at risk of homelessness at the point that they're ready to start thinking about going back to work or progressing into some kind of stability. So we will work with other agencies who engage with people to the point that they're street sleeping or that they're kind of right in the middle of their of their homelessness challenges. And they will then take referrals from organisations like Centerpoint and New Horizon, Youth Organisation, a number of prisoners abroad. So a number of other agencies who support the people to get to the point where they are currently not abusing substances, where they've got somewhere safe to sleep and where they're ready to start thinking about moving their life forward. So then they come to us. They initially do an intensive personal development and employment preparation programme where they really, that's all based in the House and we work with them on all the how to get a job and CVs and employment, and they do work experience both in the club and in our offices based on their passion. So we have a whole range, whether they're working in our art collection or whether they're working on membership or in finance or in the kitchen. So we offer work experience. But I think what makes us really distinctive is that alongside that focus on work, we have a real focus on their personal development. So they're very much part of our community here. The team with a kind of meditation sessions as part of the programme. Normally they'd go to the theatre, they do an art tour of the building. So it's really about helping people rebuild their sense of dignity and community and that they're that they're a whole person. And there's a lot going on for them. They're not just a unit who's been homeless and now needs a job they're not just about, so that really works well. And the group's really bond. And then following that, we work with people, we provide people with progression support for a year after the programme so that really helps them focus on, so then we help them move into more secure accommodation. We help them get better work, so aiming to get people not just into fragile entry level jobs, but into living wage jobs that are kind of fulfilling for them and also they have a, they have a mentor who really helps them kind of give them that additional support and community. So it's really focussed on those three things, a secure home, a good job, and a community of people that will be there to support them for the long term. And that is how we think you genuinely break the cycle of homelessness rather than hold people in a position where they're kind of fragile and waiting for the next thing to go wrong.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, that's amazing. And I mean, maybe it sort of goes without saying, but I wonder how it's been affected this year, because I imagine that it's been tough for you both on the club side and also on the Employment Academy side. And how has how have you managed this year? I mean, how have you sort of pivoted or what have you had to do?
Rosie Ferguson So firstly, on the employment economy side, when lockdown happened in March, we had, we normally support people for a year and then aim to get them in a secure place by that point, whereas we decided we had 100 hundred people who'd graduated in the last couple of years who were in contact with us, and we absolutely focussed on upping the support to them. So we increased the number of mentor engagements, we sent out food packages, we did kind of, we provided counselling for some people who were really struggling. A lot of those people, so 50 percent of that cohort that were working in March. 50 percent of them are now being made redundant or are no longer in work. I mean, it was really sad to see people because a lot of people have been focussing on the hospitality sector, the impact on them. Additionally, obviously, everything went online and actually that community of people really rely on things like libraries to be able to have Internet access and digital. So suddenly people were totally cut off from not just accessing universal credit, which is all done online, not NHS appointments were all online, but they were also cut off from their own friends and family because all of that contact, both social and public and professional life, all moved online. So we did work supporting people trying to get access to laptops, to access to digital. And yeah, so that was a really intensive period and navigating those fluctuations in income when actually they didn't have the digital capacity to do their universal credit claims and so it was is a really challenging time. And, but also carrying on the theme around peoples, you know, people being whole, people, actually, some people, well, there was one individual actually who really want to play the guitar. And we managed to find somebody in our membership who donated a guitar that person learnt the guitar. So it's kind of yes, we were helping people to kind of make sure they could eat but actually for all of us that mental health element. We also had a couple of bikes donated by members so that graduates could use bikes so they could travel to work. They could. So. So, yeah, it was it was quite active and intensive. We then once we opened again, ran programme. We know that not having any face to face contact is really detrimental to the community we support, particularly people who are living in hostels or in kind of insecure accommodation where they're just shot in their room. So we we decided to run programme. We were quite nervous about doing it face to face, but we really put in place so much covid secure practice so obviously, being in the hospitality sector, we have to be any way into the masks and social distancing and hand sanitiser stations in every room. So we did manage to run a programme and run all of the work experience. And actually I think it was one of the best programmes we've ever run because the people were so desperate to be. We had 100 percent completion, even though it was in the middle of a pandemic, because I think people's people's needs to engage and connect and feel like they were moving forward in their lives was was really, really important. So we have managed to run programme and we're now supporting all those people to think about what next in terms of the business. Sadly, we have been closed, we have we're down 40 percent on our income this year, so we've had we have had a huge financial impact. We've obviously managed to save some funds, obviously, by making use of the furlough scheme. Sadly we have had to reduce the size of our team through redundancies. But actually we've increased the scale of work we're doing to support those who we serve because the level of need is so much higher. So it's tough. And we've had we've certainly had some very challenging moments. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that by by the summer of next year, we might be getting somewhere back to normal.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, yeah. And I and I wonder I mean, it sounds like you've done some amazing work in the short term and and sort of mid-term to cope with the pandemic and the effects of that. But I wonder, do you have a view as to what the long term looks like both for the academy and the club? And will you be making changes have there been any because sometimes there have been some pleasant surprises along the way, few and far between, but there can be a couple.
Rosie Ferguson I think, in terms of the club, one of the things that's changed is I think how people will work going forward. And I think now people, I think most people won't be going into, people who work in offices, won't be going into offices five days a week. So a lot of organisations I know who are kind of getting rid of their offices entirely, from what I heard someone say the other day that actually offices will be more like member clubs going forward because people will do their, their kind of desk space work at home and people will come in to town or into the office in order to engage with people, to connect with colleagues. They won't necessarily need to come into an office to do their desk work. So I think that actually creates a real opportunity for members' clubs because that is absolutely what our space is for. So hopefully, hopefully there will be a shift towards that. And we're looking at the kind of packages we can offer. I think the real focus on the Black Lives Matter movement through this year has been really exciting. And it's made us I mean, I think we already had a strong agenda around inclusivity, what it's enabled is some really open conversations about how it feels to be a black person in a members' club and that actually you know I've heard some pretty yeah distressing and unacceptable stories of people feeling indifferent membership and environments that people look at them as though they shouldn't be there. And I think we've really determined to make sure that The House of St Barnabas is a place where we're actually we're a really thriving, diverse community that reflects London and where everybody feels like it's there, it's their space. And we've currently got an exhibition on the artist Gaikai has done exploring the relationship between the the fabric of the building here and the historic links to slavery and to plantations in Jamaica. So that's really anyone's welcome to come and have a look around that if they'd like to.
Frankie Cotton Gosh, that sounds interesting.
Rosie Ferguson Yeah. Our director of engagement here actually originated from, her family came from the area of Jamaica, which was owned as plantations by the person that built from some of the kind of main features of the house here. So some really interesting connections to have been exploring. In terms of the employment academy, I think we've in the programme this year, we did an increased focus on kind of health and safety work and increased focus on digital, because I think whatever sector people are going into really making sure that they have that digital skill and connectivity is going to be even more important than ever before. And then thinking about the industries that we're supporting people into, historically, we've supported a lot of people in hospitality and we won't stop having that connection with hospitality but really thinking actually debt advice, for example, has been one area where we've been able to support people into, you know, what are the and actually a lot many of our many of the people who we work with are actually well equipped to go into that kind of role, having had personal experience themselves, so really thinking about what are the jobs that will provide security to people on the other side of this. And also, how do we make sure that the hospitality sector is kind of built back better in terms of the types of contracts and pay and and things that we've seen as kind of making people catastrophically vulnerable I would say.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, definitely. Now, Rosie, as if you're not busy enough, you're also chair of the Association of Chief Executives of Voluntary Organisations. And from your perspective in that role, I wonder sort of a bit more generally and a bit more broadly, how is the sector doing right now in light of this turbulent year?
Rosie Ferguson Yeah, I mean, I would say the first thing to say is that the pandemic has hit those who are already at the bottom or already those people who charities are mainly there to support, whether that's young people, single parents, people living with cancer, people who are carers, people who are many of the communities that charities exist to support people with dementia, like they're the people who have been worst hit by the pandemic in terms of whether that's to do with all of the complex issues around what lockdown's created, where the kind of prioritisation of capability in the NHS. So I would say the sector is in the most part, dealing with much greater need, with much less resource, because at the same time giving to charities has reduced, a lot of the fundraising opportunities like the marathon and things that and also charities like us that rely on social enterprise income, many of whom have shifted over the last decade or two, where social enterprise income has been a focus of where we want to get and then obviously that's being completely decimated for many people, so it is a tough time, I think, for leadership, for chief executive staff and charities, often a lot of people be furloughed, a lot of people are made redundant. So you've essentially got less resource and more need. So it is a challenging time. I think some of the some of the positives, if I, you know, I am an optimist. I'm always determined to see some silver linings in this. I think the pandemic has seen a speed of innovation in some charity where, where, where charities have been forced to very quickly move online and kind of digitise some of their services in a way that would have been a kind of five year digital transformation programme that happened in five weeks or five days in some cases. So I think certainly there's been a huge shift, which I think will put the sector in good stead for the future. And I think also some of the some of the kind of risk taking and the the way that charities are really, here I would say at The House of St Barnabas when when you're really pressured around the finances, a real conversation, a board level about what matters and is this worth fighting for? And do do we believe that riding through this in order to make sure we can deliver our impact on the other side is critical? And actually, I think certainly our board trustees are really focussed on that and making sure that we absolutely deliver a greater impact on the other side of this, I think, so I think it has focussed a lot of charities, but there's no doubt that it's been challenging and that there are still, but I think next year we're going to really see a lot of charities who've been working on causes where they've made real progress over the last 10 years. They're going to have seen some of that progress move backwards in terms of poverty and many of the issues the charities campaigned on.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, I mean, it's a tough one, isn't it? And I and I appreciate your your optimism about sort of some of the innovations, but it is just a bit of a shit situation, you know. Like you say is there's more demand and less resources in this. Yeah. There's no quick or easy solution to either of those things. But I do wonder Rosie, sort of looking forward for perhaps people listening to this podcast who either work in the voluntary sector, perhaps thinking about starting a charity or looking at social impact, social enterprise – what do you think is sort of the key to and maybe this is the million dollar question, but to kind of creating and leading organisations that optimise impact? Because what you do in The House of St Barnabas feels, as I said before, really innovative. And and you have that sort of commercial and the charity working together. And I wonder, is that sort of something that you see is as happening more and more in the future? Or what's your view on that?
Rosie Ferguson I think for me, it depends really what difference people are trying to make. And there will be the kind of form and structure and exactly what you do will differ depending on the change that you're trying to see. So for some, I previously worked for Gingerbread, the single parent charity, and it was clear there that that growth was about changing policy because actually the the structural inequality facing single parents around the kind of public financing and a lot of the kind of public services with so, that actually delivering services to one thousand, two thousand three thousand people a year was not going to cut it. And so I think that was an organisation where what we needed to do was to really focus on the structural change. There are other charities that are a local youth project, for example, where actually it's really about really engaging that community and bringing in as much kind of social capital locally and volunteers as necessary. And that is where probably trusts and foundations is the right is the right method. And then there's organisations like ours where actually building a community of employers and mentors and and, um, the kind of commercial offer is a part of the way we can deliver our impact. So I think it really, I don't think there's kind of one thing, one way that people should approach delivering social impacts it's kind of what are you trying to change and then what's the best form in order to deliver that? I think being really clear about the differences people are trying to make and the most effective way to do that, and continually open to kind of challenging that and asking those questions again and again as the charity evolves as well.
Frankie Cotton Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I can see that. And I wonder Rosie a bit more of a sort of personal question, but reflecting on your career and what's led you to this point. Again, for somebody listening who perhaps works in the sector, or is thinking about it. What advice would you give to someone?
Rosie Ferguson So my, one of my early bosses in the sector had a poster on his wall that said work hard and be nice to people and that that has always stuck with me as a you know, I think we're here in the sector to make impact, and I think the people who I know who, the people who I like working with, the people who I know who kind of progress in the sector is actually kind of take responsibility for what you can change, build strong and trusting relationships with people inside and outside of your organisation and be the best you can be, you know. And that's not about working yourself to death, that's also, of course, about looking after yourself and but actually commit to what you're doing and take responsibility and don't wait for other people to kind of hand opportunities to you or to take the other thing is around asking, you know, ask forgiveness, not permission. We, don't sit around waiting for someone else to ask you for help, like, actually see what the opportunities are, see what needs to change and take responsibility for fixing it. And that's where that's certainly throughout my career in terms of probably too much sometimes, but probably get better at saying, actually, I'm not going to do that and delegates it out to somebody else. But I certainly think, yes, see what needs to be. If you think something needs to be changed, you're the probably the best person to change it.
Frankie Cotton Yeah, yeah. I love that. That's very powerful. And I wonder Rosie what sort of drives you and keeps you going because I imagine that, you know, some days can be can be tough. And, you know, you see all sorts of of different situations and people really tough situations as well. And I wonder what keeps you motivated and what drives you through those?
Rosie Ferguson I think seeing the, having programme here, I had a young man from Nigeria on work experience with me as part of our programme that we had just before this lockdown and having him working alongside me and his absolute brilliance and ambition and clarity of what it was that he wanted to do, despite the challenges that he's faced, was really inspiring. And I think it's certainly here at the House that keeps us all motivated through this challenging year, having participants' around and working alongside us who are so keen to learn and to progress and to kind of move their lives forward. Yeah, I think that impact and also just being with people, I'm just saying it's just on the last day of the second lockdown and I live on my own, so I am just delighted, I bounded out of bed this morning, bounded into the gym. I've already had like 59 conversations with different people. So just the opportunity to be, and being here at the House, the energy and the atmosphere that we can have, even when we're not able to be all-singing, all-dancing, literally, as we normally are. Yeah. So I would say the kind of personal connections with people who I have come across day today.
Frankie Cotton Gosh. Well, Rosie, I really want to come over and have a coffee and a mulled wine.
Rosie Ferguson Please do, you're very welcome.
Frankie Cotton And all of it. And I'm in no doubt that anyone listening to this podcast is also feeling the same. Sounds like a wonderful place to be, especially in the lead up to Christmas at the moment. Well, Rosie, thank you so much for everything you've shared with us and for telling us all about the work that you do. I just want to give you the opportunity before we close. Is there anything that we've not mentioned or something that you'd like to leave us on?
Rosie Ferguson Just, I suppose, a plug that we are open for membership. And if people would like to come and be part of The House of St Barnabas community, we also are a private higher venue. So once people are allowed to start organising meetings and parties, let's hope one day we might be allowed to have parties. Please think of us. And yeah, you can come and be in a fabulous space while supporting a brilliant cause.
Frankie Cotton Brilliant. Thank you so much.
Rosie Ferguson Thanks a lot.
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